air nozzle

krap101 · August 9th, 2007, 23:18

I was wondering how efficient blowing a bb down the barrel was? wouldn't it work better if instead of the air nozzle, you use something more like a paintball gun? Where the bolt hits the bb.

The Saint · August 9th, 2007, 23:42

Paintball use a striking system? That's the first time I've heard that. Sounds pretty unlikely, besides the fact that all the markers I've seen are pneumatic, considering how soft paintballs are compared to BBs.

As for a striker system versus pneumatics, issue of projectile intregity in the face of being hit with something solid aside, a striker will only provide acceleration for the duration it is in contact with the projectile while a pneumatic system will keep accelerating the projectile as long as it's in the barrel.

krap101 · August 10th, 2007, 00:46

yeah paintball uses a striking system. you pull the bolt back, and the hammer catches on the sear. when the sear releases, (the hammer is attached to the bolt) it pulls the bolt with it, and pushes the paintball out.

Greylocks · August 10th, 2007, 11:06

Psst, when you are talking about gun parts... there is a section for that called Upgrades and Modifications. This is about the guns themselves, not the components.

krap101 · August 10th, 2007, 14:19

ic... lol for some reason, i've been thinking this section was airsoft general something or other.. but i guess theres another section for general... woops..

ILLusion · August 10th, 2007, 19:54

Your idea of a paintball guns operation is skewed. You may want to do more research before doing any experimenting...

Paintball guns are pneumatic powered, whether it's gas powered semi-auto, fully automatic, or single shot cocking.

The sear holds the hammer or piston in place. When the sear is tripped, it may drop a hammer, but the hammer does NOT hit the paintball. It strikes a gas release valve to release a puff of gas that propels the BB. For a single shot cocking gun, releasing the sear releases the piston which launches forward in a compression cylinder - the air volume in that cylinder is what pushes the paintball out.

This is the same concept as in many airsoft guns. AEGs have just taken it one step further by completely removing the need for a compressed air source and using electro-mechanics to constantly drive the piston.

If "striking" a projectile seemed like it was better, then why do REAL guns use an expanding gas method of propulsion? Why do mortars, missiles and cannons all rely on some type of propulsion system that is based on expanding air/gas/vapour?

You're trying to reinvent the wheel.

Case in point: Why is it when you play billiards, the 8-ball does not get launched at a greater speed than the cue ball when struck? Because it's not that effective as a propulsion method.
The best you'd get is a 1:1 transfer of energy.

krap101 · August 12th, 2007, 00:51

well i was tired, and my sentence was real off, but i never said the hammer hit the paintball... i was trying to say the bolt hits the paintball. and in your explanation you go inbetween paintball and airsoft.

and its not 1:1 because alot of the air goes around the bb, unless you have a tightbore, but its probably not that close to 1:1

Skladfin · August 12th, 2007, 00:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by krap101

well i was tired, and my sentence was real off, but i never said the hammer hit the paintball... i was trying to say the bolt hits the paintball. and in your explanation you go inbetween paintball and airsoft.

and its not 1:1 because alot of the air goes around the bb, unless you have a tightbore, but its probably not that close to 1:1

lol excuse

The Saint · August 12th, 2007, 01:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by krap101

well i was tired, and my sentence was real off, but i never said the hammer hit the paintball... i was trying to say the bolt hits the paintball. and in your explanation you go inbetween paintball and airsoft.

You do realize that it doesn't matter whether you said the hammer or bolt hits the paintball, right? Because neither actually hits the paintball.

Quote:

and its not 1:1 because alot of the air goes around the bb, unless you have a tightbore, but its probably not that close to 1:1

ILLusion was talking about a striking system being 1:1 at best, not the pneumatic system.

Styrak · August 12th, 2007, 01:02

Idiots (except Illusion, who is right). I can't believe this thread.

The Saint · August 12th, 2007, 01:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Styrak

Idiots (except Illusion, who is right).

Geez, thanks.

Ronan · August 12th, 2007, 01:23

ILLusion · August 12th, 2007, 05:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by krap101

well i was tired, and my sentence was real off, but i never said the hammer hit the paintball... i was trying to say the bolt hits the paintball. and in your explanation you go inbetween paintball and airsoft.

and its not 1:1 because alot of the air goes around the bb, unless you have a tightbore, but its probably not that close to 1:1

You... totally don't get it, do you? Bolts activate a compression system that's based on PNEUMATIC energy to drive the projectile. Guess what the bolt does? It holds a sear back. What does the sear do in airsoft and paintball guns? It releases a:

a) hammer to strike a GAS RELEASE valve - the GAS is what propels the BB
b) piston to compress air in a compression chamber - the air is what drives the BB.

Since we're reinventing projectile systems, let's do the wheel as well:

I believe that a cube shaped wheel is better, as it has 6 sides, whereas a standard circle only has 2 (front and back). The 6 sides has more surface area to travel over the path of travel.

Dustball · August 12th, 2007, 05:47

I like rectangles. I think they would work good.

GreyFox132 · August 12th, 2007, 09:44

make that square go really really fast and you have yourself one crazy circle where all the points of the square are arbitrarily close to the shape of a circle that moving would be easy

but that would require retarded light speeds

also 2 ovals would work fairly well once you get going, just offset one 90 degrees

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August 9th, 2007, 23:18	#1
krap101 Trader rating Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Roscoe, IL USA	air nozzle I was wondering how efficient blowing a bb down the barrel was? wouldn't it work better if instead of the air nozzle, you use something more like a paintball gun? Where the bolt hits the bb.

August 9th, 2007, 23:42	#2
The Saint Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Quebec	Paintball use a striking system? That's the first time I've heard that. Sounds pretty unlikely, besides the fact that all the markers I've seen are pneumatic, considering how soft paintballs are compared to BBs. As for a striker system versus pneumatics, issue of projectile intregity in the face of being hit with something solid aside, a striker will only provide acceleration for the duration it is in contact with the projectile while a pneumatic system will keep accelerating the projectile as long as it's in the barrel. __________________ "The Bird of Hermes is My Name, Eating My Wings to Make Me Tame."

August 10th, 2007, 19:54	#6
ILLusion GBB Whisperer Trader rating Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Toronto	Your idea of a paintball guns operation is skewed. You may want to do more research before doing any experimenting... Paintball guns are pneumatic powered, whether it's gas powered semi-auto, fully automatic, or single shot cocking. The sear holds the hammer or piston in place. When the sear is tripped, it may drop a hammer, but the hammer does NOT hit the paintball. It strikes a gas release valve to release a puff of gas that propels the BB. For a single shot cocking gun, releasing the sear releases the piston which launches forward in a compression cylinder - the air volume in that cylinder is what pushes the paintball out. This is the same concept as in many airsoft guns. AEGs have just taken it one step further by completely removing the need for a compressed air source and using electro-mechanics to constantly drive the piston. If "striking" a projectile seemed like it was better, then why do REAL guns use an expanding gas method of propulsion? Why do mortars, missiles and cannons all rely on some type of propulsion system that is based on expanding air/gas/vapour? You're trying to reinvent the wheel. Case in point: Why is it when you play billiards, the 8-ball does not get launched at a greater speed than the cue ball when struck? Because it's not that effective as a propulsion method. The best you'd get is a 1:1 transfer of energy. __________________ *Advanced Airsoft Armaments and Enhancements* Quick to the gun, sure of your grip. Quick to the threat, sure of your shot. Diligentia, Vis, Celeritas Accuracy, Power, Speed Last edited by ILLusion; August 10th, 2007 at 19:59..

August 10th, 2007, 00:46	#3
krap101 Trader rating Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Roscoe, IL USA	yeah paintball uses a striking system. you pull the bolt back, and the hammer catches on the sear. when the sear releases, (the hammer is attached to the bolt) it pulls the bolt with it, and pushes the paintball out.

August 10th, 2007, 11:06	#4
Greylocks Trader rating Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Gatineau, Quebec (Near Ottawa)	Psst, when you are talking about gun parts... there is a section for that called Upgrades and Modifications. This is about the guns themselves, not the components.

August 10th, 2007, 14:19	#5
krap101 Trader rating Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Roscoe, IL USA	ic... lol for some reason, i've been thinking this section was airsoft general something or other.. but i guess theres another section for general... woops..

August 12th, 2007, 00:51	#7
krap101 Trader rating Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Roscoe, IL USA	well i was tired, and my sentence was real off, but i never said the hammer hit the paintball... i was trying to say the bolt hits the paintball. and in your explanation you go inbetween paintball and airsoft. and its not 1:1 because alot of the air goes around the bb, unless you have a tightbore, but its probably not that close to 1:1

August 12th, 2007, 01:02	#10
Styrak Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Saskatoon, SK	Idiots (except Illusion, who is right). I can't believe this thread. __________________ Airsoft Sales and Repair/Upgrade Services

August 12th, 2007, 05:47	#14
Dustball Trader rating Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Calgary	I like rectangles. I think they would work good.

August 12th, 2007, 09:44	#15
GreyFox132 Trader rating Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Barrie Ontario	make that square go really really fast and you have yourself one crazy circle where all the points of the square are arbitrarily close to the shape of a circle that moving would be easy but that would require retarded light speeds also 2 ovals would work fairly well once you get going, just offset one 90 degrees

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