I am completely torn between the two

[TheEngineer]

Okay so I have been doing insane research on two guns and some days I am for one than the next I am for another. I am on tilt like a mofo !

GUN #1

VFC VR16 SABER CQB


GUN #2

ICS Transform4 CXP UK1

No need for introduction to these two guns we all know about them please help me go to one side.

*I am age verified, I am just waiting for bloodsport to give me access to my old account because hotmail is being difficult with emails from this site* (I took a break for school and forgot my password to the account and waiting for it to come back to me)

[devbro]

if you have the money and want a gun that would be stock for a long time, go VFC. I have both ICS and VFC guns and VFC is by far higher quality.

[BioRage]

1, no doubt.

[Hectic]

Agreed, if you've got the cash the VFC is a much nicer gun externally.
Not sure of the ics internally (never opened one) but for the vfc it may want some attention, my 417 had a polycarb piston that wouldn't have lasted long and I wasn't partial to the self shimming gears. Not that it's a horrible system I don't personally think it is the most durable.

[TheEngineer]

Thanks guys for the replies I know these questions come up a lot and I would like to mention you guys do a great job tackling them.

That being said, externally VFC wins i'll give that to them.
But I am not seeing how it's necessarily a no brainer for the VFC.
CXP is still solid externally and has their infamous split gearbox.
Also the price difference being that the CXP is cheaper I could put that money into a bit more upgrades internally.
The CXP also has the release spring tension when you put it on safety.
Also the Electric Blow Back for CXP is easy to disable because it's useless for me.
Lastly the metal hop up for the ICS is proprietary but I heard it's still very solid.

I am not trying to argue but rather have you VFC ride or dies elaborate more and get me off the fence.

[Flavio]

I have no experience on the ICS but I have a 1 month old Saber CQB. I'd sleep with it if I could. Rock solid construction, shoots .28s like a laser and looks gorgeous with the URX rail covers

They do look similar though. You can go to a store and put both side by side. The one you pick up and smile is the one.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[pestobanana]

VFC is better in every category except ease of disassembly. VFC requires a decent degree of spacial aptitude, ICS is almost idiot proof because of the split gearbox. At the same time, VFC tolerances are much better so in that aspect it is easier to work on than ICS.

VFC performance and internal quality is better than ICS. ICS externals aren't even remotely comparable to VFC.

People complain about VFC internals, but those complaints are usually from either older models or people that don't know what they're talking about. Pre 2015 models came with polycarbonate tappet plates and pistons, which were the most common failures - yet they were no more common than those same failures on other brands. 2015 and 2016 models come with much more durable tappet plates and pistons. I have yet to see a tappet failure and I have only seen one piston failure in the newer models. And to those that say VFC gears suck or their self shimming system sucks... I've worked on at least 100 VFC gearboxes by now, I have never seen an issue caused by the gears or self shimming system. I'm not saying I would use self shimming in upgraded guns, but for a stock gun there is no reason to change it.

[ThunderCactus]

VFC.
The features you listed for the ics are largely superficial.

[TheEngineer]

Alright two doctors have given me the same diagnosis I guess it's going to have to be the VFC.

Now that I am officially on the VFC side now.

For all VR16s the internals are the same however externals are not. Should I just get the cheapest one and then put my own rail system and stock? or is the rail system and stock that comes with the VR16 SABER really good and worth it?

Would I be saving money one way or the other?

[pestobanana]

Not ALL of the internals are the same. The 2015s are different from the 2016s. The 2016 VR16s have quick spring change gearboxes and come with MOSFETs installed inside the gearbox. They call it the ECS gearbox.

From what I have seen, 2015 gearboxes have standard triggers, 2016 gearboxes have flat triggers.

Among the VR16s the externals look different, but the quality is the same. Pick the one you like and use that. VFC rails are as good as you need an airsoft rail to be. The only reasons to change would be if you were to change for cosmetic reasons or to upgrade to a real steel rail. I would not consider DyTac or MadBull rails an upgrade over the VFC original rail.

[Wilkie]

I find Dytac's metal to be pretty soft, I wouldn't really consider them better than VFC's. I've also seen defects in their rails, including a barrel nut that was threaded crooked.

I recommend Madbull rails. They have a lot of verity, though most of them don't except a gas tube, as to prevent someone from using them on real steel.

I would also very much recommend PTS' rails, like their Centurion Arms replica, perhaps even more so than Madbull. They also don't have to be modified to except a gas tube, which is a plus.

That said I'm at the point where I'm leaning toward real steel in most cases.