How old should you really be?

[wildcard]

Originally Posted by Avanarius

While I totally agree with you; I consider myself a pretty rational and understanding person so I have to bring up one point. Have you ever thought that bashing, flaming, attacking, name calling, and a lot of what I have seen above does absolutely nothing to help fix the problem for the entire airsoft community, and actually makes it worse?

Well you are a smart and reasonable guy no? you should be able to turn off the bullshit chatter advice /flame and keep those whos advice that make sense. There are plenty of answer to fixed the issue at hand that has already been mentioned above, Full seal goggles is a start, minimum age is another. This hobby with its rapid expansion has its pros and cons just like paintball years ago, unfortunately with the addition of internet thrown in and keyboard warriors added to the mix all fucking commonsense are thrown out. So another freebie advice don't step into bullshit, observe/read more, argue less. there are clubs around or near your area should you wish to ask for help. Remember all it take is one of the little kiddies to get hurt because someone choose to be a nice guy and ignore the advice given here, Guns and kids whether its real or just toys don't mix in the general mind especially soccer moms.

[Janus]

Originally Posted by Avanarius

No questions. This isn't my problem to fix for THIS online community. It's a problem to fix to keep MY community safe.

And if you're at all intelligent you'll recognize that ASC is a wonderful information resource full of people who have been in your position before. Those people will be happy to provide you with things they've learned from experience, especially in the interest of safety.

So if you want to fix safety issues in your community, then this is a good set of brains to pick for ways how.

[Ready]

Originally Posted by Avanarius

CV Airsoft organizer / assister / helper person (whatever you want to call me) here; there's so much incorrect information going around in this thread it's not even funny. So I'll ignore most of what's in this thread and tell everyone this: We're all very new to this. Not once; I repeat not once has a single person voiced any concerns to me, and I am essentially next in line to the 'leader'. I do understand that the age limit is well; pretty laxing, well since tonight (I learned as I read). That said: I will be changing what the restrictions are or I will simply not play anymore.

As for protection, eye protection is definitely mandatory; I wouldn't let a single person out of my sight without it. The sealed eye protection seems like a good idea. Although, without minors, I don't see much need for any more protection personally. We might need to enforce it in the future as the guns get more powerful but I just haven't seen much of a need for it and I've been shot by the worst of the worst from what our players bring.

All I can ask of this thread is to please not assume everything here is true because it's not. if you have any questions just post them in this thread and I will respond and will do anything I can in my power to install protective measures.

You never did address the issue of using land owned by the government, without their consent, to shoot at kids half your age. There is something called trespassing which your entire group is guilty of.


That is unless the OP has lied about everything he has said in this thread, as you hinted, or accused, whichever goes down better.

[Mr.Shiney]

Firstly this is not a flamefest. As I for one have yet to grab some thermite, pressure up my flamethower or soak any rags in gasoline.

A member of your community has expressed valid concerns.

We are attempting to educate/inform you of what would be considered a normal safety best practice in the rest of Canada.

Secondly, in this context there is no: this group, that group, my group and/or your group. Whatever happen with any one group can and definitley will impact the remainder of us. If the Rabid Soccer Mom Society does not eat you alive, the CBC will definitely provide an incomplete picture of what happened.

If you choose to operate in a public forum / venue, that has the exposure that you do. The remainder of the Canadian Airsoft Community can be tarred and feathered with the same brush. This is regardless of the community or forum(s) you are a member of. The actions or lack of action by a group, team or forum in Halifax, can impact your little community on Vancouver Island.

Our primary concern is simple. We a much larger national collective do not want become involved in needless and unwarranted scrutiny or imposed regulation. Due to the actions of neglience or incompetence of others.

I suggest you seek legal counsel in regards to the issues and concerns we have expressed. You will find that we are not collectively talking out of our asses. You will find that for the better part, we have expressed legimate concerns and the possible outcomes or consequences.

[Ricochet]

What your group is guilty of is not really in question. We've seen your videos on YouTube, read your website, and heard from a witness; three strikes your out. If your earnest in your efforts to improve things and take this seriously, first off "good for you", and let us give you some advice.

Some of these are suggestions, and some "must" be mandatory.

- The guy who "runs" your group, seems to have made some very inexcusable descisions for someone his age. Tyler Voigt is it? I'd get some space from him quickly. Someone needs to give his head a shake. If he persists, threatens, or bullies anyone that tries to make things better and safer, I'd report him. He's collecting money on crown land, issuing phoney bullshit waivers, and shooting at children, for starters. He may not go to jail, but he needs to know the authorities are watching.

- If your going to run a pay airsoft site, you'll need the following. A private or rented property that is zoned for that sort of thing. A business license, a properly written waiver, the proper insurance, and a detailed information brochure on all the risks associated for players/parents to read. That's just for starters. You'll need all the things business must have though. Some are listed earlier in this post.

- If you decide to just run a non pay, private team kind of thing; then private property will do. If you have "any" members that are underage, you will still need insurance, waivers, etc. That is just scratching the surface.

- I'd eliminate anyone under sixteen immediately, either way you go. If someone under eighteen is going to play, they must have a parent/guardian present "at all time", have read and understood the rules, and signed a legal waiver. Also Insurance must be present to protect them and yourself.

- If your playing on private property, you will have to consider the safety of your neighbors and community. You may even want to let the local authorities know what, where, and when you play; so there are no "situations".

- Safety gear is an absolute. "All" safety eyewear "must" meat the CSA, ANSI regulations, and "must" protect your eyes adequately all the way around. Not to mention they have to be reasonably held onto your face. If you trip, stumble, get bumped, etc, they "must" stay on. All safety eyewear "must" remain on a players face at all times (no exceptions), until they are clear if the gaming area, and in a designated "safe" zone. A safe zone "must" be safe from projectiles originating within and outside of itself.

- "All" players including staff, team leaders, etc, "must" have "all" of their guns chrinographed and checked by a responsible, suitable, and adequate individual(s) on a regular basis. The instrument used "must" be properly calibrated and tested for accuracy, and "all" manufacturers instructions "must" be followed during it's operation. You'll also want to make sure that every gun on your field is legal as well. There are some posts and links to what you should know, here on ASC.

- Other safety concerns "must" be observed. Such as but limited to: the safety of all players, staff, visitors, spectators, wildlife, environment, civilians, property, and attendees at all times and with all reasonable entirety. Think about making boots with at least 6' - 8' ankle support and non-slip soles mandatory as well as eye protection. Throat, yoke, mouth, face, and head guards for those under eighteen as well, so their jugulars, temples, teeth, etc, are protected.

Now that I've barely just laid out some "really basic" ground rules, you should look into it more. There are teams, groups, businesses, players, and staff here on ASC whom share a complete and near unlimited Airsoft knowledge and experience. Look into what they have done for detailed field rules and safety precautions. You can copy if you want. Many large game ops have a very long and detailed list of field rules that'll help encompass your whole game experience.

I hope you make all necessary changes, and remember that we are here if needs be. Don't attack us for we are legion, and have been there done that. Our concern is that the best interests of airsoft in Canada and those involved is being taken seriously. Safety is paramount, and hurt feelings are not. Stay away from selfish morons who will hurt your fun, safety, friends, and players.

If your looking for any other info, it's probably posted here a hundred times. It will seem as if it's endless reading, but that should tell you that there is many important things to consider. If you act honestly and with truth then we are in your corner.

Good luck!

[Janus]

To be fair, Plague (OP) has PM'ed me and asked for help. Being fairly local to him, I'm actually quite willing to help out.

Also dude, I'll be on my way through Comox in a couple weeks. Wouldn't be shit to me to sit down and help you figure out the problems in your group (primarily safety) and maybe help you come up with solutions.

I mean.. every group has its problems, right?



I mean..

just ripped my sniper apart and cleaned it out so unclean (: now it is and i managed to stick my bipod on my pistol lol

nothing to see here...



completely legit...



I can't see anything wrong here...



milutary graed smoek

BUT NO... seriously, we can work with this.. You just need to slapfuck some of these tards.

[Ricochet]

I'm glad you decided to go help in person Janus. Your a gentleman and scholar. I hope you guys appreciate his time and listen to what he has to say.

[HackD]

Originally Posted by Avanarius

While I totally agree with you; I consider myself a pretty rational and understanding person so I have to bring up one point. Have you ever thought that bashing, flaming, attacking, name calling, and a lot of what I have seen above does absolutely nothing to help fix the problem for the entire airsoft community, and actually makes it worse?

To a certain degree, i do apologize for being rather bullish with my comments. However, by the same token, being 'nice' often does not get a message across about an issue with the required urgency, where corrective measures are required to be taken, and attitudes un-fucked post-haste. There are potentially dire consequences about to arrive in a shit-storm of epic proportions, for all involved. You were defending an undefendable situation and making excuses for circumstance in your first posts, pure and simple.

Now that we've made nice-nice.. get your "great Leaders" attention on this, and focused upon the recommended fixes given to you so far. This whole situation cannot be allowed to continue. If the "great Leader" continues to be an obstinate dick about it - then it's high time to cut him loose and/or distance yourself from the impending shit-storm.

[nickssj21]

Originally Posted by HackD

To a certain degree, i do apologize for being rather bullish with my comments. However, by the same token, being 'nice' often does not get a message across about an issue with the required urgency, where corrective measures are required to be taken, and attitudes un-fucked post-haste. There are potentially dire consequences about to arrive in a shit-storm of epic proportions, for all involved. You were defending an undefendable situation and making excuses for circumstance in your first posts, pure and simple.

Now that we've made nice-nice.. get your "great Leaders" attention on this, and focused upon the recommended fixes given to you so far. This whole situation cannot be allowed to continue. If the "great Leader" continues to be an obstinate dick about it - then it's high time to cut him loose and/or distance yourself from the impending shit-storm.

Well said. I should apologize for my language and offensive manner as well. I just don't like seeing these kinds of situation where people are ignorant and think they "run shit like a boss". You guys will get great help from Janus I am sure, so listen well. Good luck, you'll need it.

[Deadpool]

Originally Posted by Avanarius

As for protection, eye protection is definitely mandatory; I wouldn't let a single person out of my sight without it.

I guess you missed one...Unless you count that:Lake Trail Rush - Game Day - YouTube as "adequate" eye protection?

I'll give you a clue: Rayban aviators (and especially cheap knock offs) aren't protecting nothing but the way you look.

[чума]

Originally Posted by nickssj21

Well said. I should apologize for my language and offensive manner as well. I just don't like seeing these kinds of situation where people are ignorant and think they "run shit like a boss". You guys will get great help from Janus I am sure, so listen well. Good luck, you'll need it.

The group "leader" noes about all of this believe me (I didn't say anything) All games have been canceled until further informed.

[Ricochet]

I liked the night op video, where the kid wore his goggles down around his neck. The blind firing thing has to go as well. Blind fire can be quite dangerous actually. I'm glad you guys contacted us. With some major changes you may have some proper airsoft fun ...only safe this time.

[JerryMcGoulBerry]

I think 14 is fine. Most experienced 14 year old players will be respectful. some may say I'm too young to play, but i work my ass off 10 hours a week at a restaurant to pay for this sport, so I'm not going to be some big mouthed little shit on the field. if some kid is being being a jerk, ban him! I wish my field would do that to all the little punks who think they run the place.

[Rommen]

Originally Posted by JerryMcGoulBerry

I think 14 is fine. Most experienced 14 year old players will be respectful. some may say I'm too young to play, but i work my ass off 10 hours a week at a restaurant to pay for this sport, so I'm not going to be some big mouthed little shit on the field. if some kid is being being a jerk, ban him! I wish my field would do that to all the little punks who think they run the place.

Unfortunately, as has been covered multiple times now in this thread, 14 year olds cannot be held LEGALLY RESPONSIBLE and therefore cannot play. It is a simple question of LEGALITY.

[Zeonprime]

Originally Posted by JerryMcGoulBerry

but i work my ass off 10 hours a week at a restaurant

Oh dear lord I think I hurt myself From laughing so hard. Fuck where is wildcard? He so needs to read this! I want to be a teenager again!!

Jerry, you kid just made my day! Don't take this post as negative, however you might want to ask whichever parent you belong to where an adult would find humor in the above statement. Oh lord yes I am pretty sure I hurt myself from laughing so damn hard, ow my sides hurt!