Clear guns are replicas, black are not?

[coghlan]

From reading the various threads, it would appear that these things have to be locked up like any other firearm, but don't require a permit. (Too bad they didn't have these when I was a teen years ago...so I wouldn't have had to fire off my .22 in my backyard in the city on PD days :-))

Anyhow, what's the deal with clear guns vs metallic? Clear guns are NOT considered replicas?

I saw these things for the first time available for sale in the local Wal-Mart while waiting for an oil change. I couldn't tell if it was a toy or what...until i saw the 380 fps spec on the blister pack. Definitely not a toy, but also not a *fire*arm.

[TrueTGN]

Those crapsoft guns you see at Walmart are, well, crap!

The 380fps rating on those is done with .12g bbs and can't be compared to real airsoft like we play with here. If you're interested you should check out the FAQ section of the forum to get a better idea about how everything works.

(Generally we play with these rules based off of FPS with .20g bbs - 350fps indoors, 400fps auto outdoors - 450 for bolt action outdoors)

As far as the whole replica/clear/metal i'll let someone else explain.

Welcome!

[coghlan]

Yeah, I did see comments about how Cdn Tire and Wal-Mart guns break. Didn't know that the FPS number was based on smaller projectiles though.

I like the gas Taurus models mfg'd by KWC (?), which I presume don't break so easily.

[tycho]

Clear guns are not considered replicas under Canadian law. They're the only type of air soft gun that can be imported. Solid body guns are considered and treated as replicas, though technically they fall into a grey area of the law (they fire, so they're not entirely a replica, but they shoot at less velocity and energy than a firearm; they are also not considered air guns).

Also, which of the wal-mart guns stated it shoots at 380 fps? Are you sure it didn't say 280?

The clear guns are also not referred to as 'air soft' but rather as 'soft-air' guns. You won't find anyone using them at a scenario or anything like that...at least, they won't be having any fun if they are :S

[coghlan]

Originally Posted by TrueTGN

As far as the whole replica/clear/metal i'll let someone else explain.

Welcome!

I asked my brother-in-law (police detective) about them, but they were news to him. I showed him a Youtube video of a guy tearing up some cans with a fully-automatic MP5 replica. He wasn't really impressed, I guess because police practice combat with REAL MP5s that shoot some kind of soap-based slugs that can tear little bits of skin off. They do this so police forces will take their training *seriously*.

He did mention that bad guys in the US paint the tips of REAL weapons with orange paint to make police pause before shooting while the bad guys shoot first.

[coghlan]

The Wal-Mart gun actually said 315 fps, not 380 fps. I just used the 380 fps number I had seen rated on a CO2 gun.

[coghlan]

Originally Posted by tycho

The clear guns are also not referred to as 'air soft' but rather as 'soft-air' guns. You won't find anyone using them at a scenario or anything like that...at least, they won't be having any fun if they are :S

U mean "soft-air" = clear gun, in Canada and US, or is this just a Cdn thing?

Discussion forums and vendors all seem to use "airsoft", so is this just a packaging thing?

[Aquamarine]

coghlan: I might suggest that you simply edit you original post and add more text, rather than creating three successive posts and cluttering up many peoples screens. Just a tip

[The Saint]

Originally Posted by tycho

Clear guns are not considered replicas under Canadian law. They're the only type of air soft gun that can be imported. Solid body guns are considered and treated as replicas, though technically they fall into a grey area of the law (they fire, so they're not entirely a replica, but they shoot at less velocity and energy than a firearm; they are also not considered air guns).

Sorry, you're way off the mark.

As a policy, CBSA doesn't recognize colour (or there lack off) as an indicator of whether something is a replica firearm or not. They know that ultimately, colour is easily changed. http://www.citt-tcce.gc.ca/appeals/d.../ap2d018_e.asp (para 13)

There is NO grey area regarding replica firearms being able to fire. There is nothing in the definition of replica firearm that says they shouldn't be able to fire.

Replica firearm can be airguns and vice-versa. Airgun is not a legal definition, you won't find it in the CCC or CFA. It merely describe what the device does.

[Muffin]

Yah, i've met with a number of CBSA agents and what they have told me is that if the gun is clear that it is not considered to be a replica firearm, regardless of the fact that any kid with paint can make it look relativly life like.
Any 'black' gun is a restricted item.

[coghlan]

Originally Posted by Muffin

Yah, i've met with a number of CBSA agents and what they have told me is that if the gun is clear that it is not considered to be a replica firearm, regardless of the fact that any kid with paint can make it look relativly life like.
Any 'black' gun is a restricted item.

Makes sense.

So, if it has a clear body and shoots below 500 fps, regardless of whether it looks like a real gun or just a pellet rifle, it's essentially treated like an air rifle/pistol, as it should be. No permit to buy or registration required.

Store and use 'em exactly as you would a pellet rifle.

Is this any different than the way paintball guns are treated?

[Muffin]

From what i've studied on this topic as long as that gun is clear it passes without a problem(and yes under 500fps), now as for transporting, i'm not sure of any definate rules in regards to clear ones, but any replica needs to be in some sort of a case, a case that wouldn't give the hint of a weapon being inside.
As for paintballing, its no problem due to the fact that it can't be mistaken for a real firearm.

[The Saint]

It's far from certain that clear guns are safe. CBSA policy, as I've actually cited, does not consider non-realistic colouring a valid defence against whether something is a replica firearm or not. What individual CBSA agents might say is IMHO, irrelevant, because they can say all sorts of things off the record and without actually being in a position to make the call, or be accountable for changing their mind at a later date. To be fair, it's the individual CBSA agents that make the call and people instinctively react to transparent guns differently than one with a solid colour, but just keep in mind that explicit, official CBSA policy and Canadian law is not on your side if your item is seized.

[Muffin]

I agree with you Saint. It totally does depend on which agent it would pass through. At the border where i cross, everyone there has told me as long as its clear it will pass. However at a small town border 20 clicks west its a different story, anything that will look like a gun they will seize.
So its pretty much a Hit-or-Miss.

[DrakeHighlander]

Some of the clearsoft at my local Walmart claim to shoot 400 FPS. I had a little chuckle in the store after seeing that.