FAQ for Tokyo Marui Hi-Capa, 2011, 1911, MEU & Detonics type variants

[ILLusion]

Originally Posted by Slono

Does anybody have a regular 5.1 length hi-capa that boasts enormous power for its standard barrel length? I'm on a quest to make a powerful regular (5.1 length slide, 5.1" barrel length) sized hi-capa, and I'm wondering what combination you guys use to achieve great results. I know the possibilities are almost infinite, but please share your build along with its FPS!

What do you consider to be "enormous"?

[RacingManiac]

I'll go home and chrono my Infinity...

[ILLusion]

The most I'd ever gotten out of a 5.1" Hi-Capa was around 315 fps with .25g BBs. Equivalent fps at that power using a 0.20g BB would be roughly 352 fps.

Parts related to power output in that build would be:
- PDI 6.01mm inner barrel
- 9Ball Hop Up rubber
- RCC Power Up Cylinder Bulb
- KM High Flow Valves

Note: If you actually fired a 0.20g BB out of that setup, your FPS would be lower. Roughly 335fps.

That fps isn't far from my current builds. I can get roughly 320-330fps with 0.20g BBs using Tanio Koba Twist barrels, Firefly hop up rubber, Action power up cylinder bulb, and KM high flow valves.

Gas is inconsistent, and they're are many factors that can skew consistency of results.
For example, a couple of times, while messing with a bone stock Marui MEU, I was putting out 310+fps with a 0.20g BB, consistently, when they're only rated for 290fps. It could have been the way I was filling the mags, or how I let the mags rest before using them. The ambient temperature may be different as well.

[pusangani]

I got 350's w/.20s using

stock slide/outer
stock internals

Unkown brand/length tightbore, I used a threaded outer as the threading covered the tiny 3mm bit that extended beyond a normal outer
king arms hammer spring
red kjw hicapa nozzle w/tm rocket valve
homemade hi-flow valves on 50rd long mags

standard 5.1 mags would give 340's

[ILLusion]

Originally Posted by pusangani

I got 350's w/.20s using

stock slide/outer
stock internals

Unkown brand/length tightbore, I used a threaded outer as the threading covered the tiny 3mm bit that extended beyond a normal outer
king arms hammer spring
red kjw hicapa nozzle w/tm rocket valve
homemade hi-flow valves on 50rd long mags

standard 5.1 mags would give 340's

It sounds like you had a longer than stock length inner barrel, no?

In my experience, inner barrel lengths greater than 112.5mm (stock length for a Hi-Capa 5.1) give the greatest FPS boosts. With a 6" barrel, you can easily see 360-370fps, and with a 7" barrel, you can see 380fps or more. With 0.25g BBs, you'll be pushing power equivalent to over 400fps with a 0.20g BB.

[pusangani]

yeh it was slightly longer, it would go past the stock outer barrel by like 2-3mm so I put a threaded outer on to cover it, the same setup with a stock inner barrel gave me high 330's

[RacingManiac]

Just chronoed, pretty much exactly on .25s over 5 shot. Mag is probably at around 65 deg F.

On .20 it just shot 320-330.

The gun currently runs PDI 6.01 barrel, NineBall bucking, and IK lightweight BBU w/ O-ring piston and SD O-ring.

[Slono]

I just chronoed my new infinity build and a string of seven shots yielded an averaged of 327.2 fps using 0.25g BBBastards which is supposed to translate to ~365 fps on 0.20g BBs using arnie's online calculator. That's the highest I've ever seen for a standard 5.1". It doesn't have upgraded flow valves, but it is fully upgraded internally.

Edit: This time I tried stuffing a BB in the MSH and I managed to get a little more power and I also installed a TK high flow valve I got from somebody. I used ILLusion's performance readout template to display my readout. Tests were done using 0.25g BBBastards.

FPS shot string:
333.4
331.3
330.4
334.3
333.1
331.3
331.9
000.0 (error shot / voided)
328.0
327.4
325.6
324.6


Average = 330.12 FPS

High Velocity = 334.3 fps
Low Velocity = 324.6 fps
Average Velocity = 330.12 fps
Average Deviations = 9.7 fps
Energy Output (avg) = 1.26 Joules
Equivalent fps in 0.20g = 368.18 fps

As you can see, due to the high amount of gas used and the voided shot in the middle of the test it started to affect performance. The average deviation was a whopping 9.7 fps. I will have to run further tests to see it was the voided shot that messed things up since every shot was fairly consistent until that point.

[ILLusion]

Originally Posted by pusangani

yeh it was slightly longer, it would go past the stock outer barrel by like 2-3mm so I put a threaded outer on to cover it, the same setup with a stock inner barrel gave me high 330's

The original inner barrel runs short of the original outer barrel by ~6.4mm, so you're looking at roughly a 1cm increase in length. That should be good enough on it's own to get you close to 350fps.

Originally Posted by Slono

I just chronoed my new infinity build and a string of seven shots yielded an averaged of 327.2 fps using 0.25g BBBastards which is supposed to translate to ~365 fps on 0.20g BBs using arnie's online calculator. That's the highest I've ever seen for a standard 5.1". It doesn't have upgraded flow valves, but it is fully upgraded internally.

What are the upgraded parts in that build?

[Leang]

Hey guys. I just ordered a TM MEU which should be arriving in a few days. Already planning upgrades, but there are a few noobish things that I'm not sure about and couldn't glean from the 35 previous pages (lol yeah, I actually read them all).

First question. My current 1911 is a cheap CO2 clone so I'm not too knowledgeable about the other gas types. The answers I've found online sometimes contradict each other and I'd rather hear it from a community that knows what they're talking about. HFC134a seems pretty tough to get here in California, and from what I've read about R134a, it seems to be the same but without the lube. And most of the people here seem to prefer propane. So many different types! Will propane, HFC134a, and R134a(this one with 1 drop of oil every few mags) all work without any special adapters or add-ons? And can a stock MEU handle the extra force from propane?

Second question. When the MEU arrives, I was planning on trying to source a KM or PDI 6.04 mm inner barrel, but I read some pages back about a Tanio Koba Twist Barrel. If this is the goto barrel for ILLusion, would this be an optimal barrel for someone like me, who's just starting to get into airsoft customization?

Thanks! I have a ton of other stuff I want to ask, but will keep it in small doses .

[Thenooblord]

propane is cheap, and is always my first choice as propellant, and a TM MEU can handle it fine, and a TK twist barrel is never a bad choice ofr a pistol

[ILLusion]

Originally Posted by Leang

First question. My current 1911 is a cheap CO2 clone so I'm not too knowledgeable about the other gas types. The answers I've found online sometimes contradict each other and I'd rather hear it from a community that knows what they're talking about. HFC134a seems pretty tough to get here in California, and from what I've read about R134a, it seems to be the same but without the lube. And most of the people here seem to prefer propane. So many different types! Will propane, HFC134a, and R134a(this one with 1 drop of oil every few mags) all work without any special adapters or add-ons? And can a stock MEU handle the extra force from propane?

HFC134a and R134a ARE the same thing. Lube is NOT the differentiation, unless it's specifically sold as an airsoft gas, and then it's just the same gas but with lube added. It is not defined as "HFC134a" or "R134a" in many cases of airsoft packaging.
134a in general is difficult to find in California's due to their "green" laws, and the fact that 134a is a hydrofluorocarbon (HFC) refrigerant that is harmful to the ozone (when released in mass quantities.) There are worse gasses for the environment.
It can still be found in California, but it is increasingly difficult to do so as more and more regulations are passed to control the sale and use.

Stick with propane. It's much cheaper, the performance benefits are much more worth it, and the MEU can handle it just fine. Except for an Airsoft Innovations propane adapter, you shouldn't need anything else to use propane on your Marui MEU.

Originally Posted by Leang

Second question. When the MEU arrives, I was planning on trying to source a KM or PDI 6.04 mm inner barrel, but I read some pages back about a Tanio Koba Twist Barrel. If this is the goto barrel for ILLusion, would this be an optimal barrel for someone like me, who's just starting to get into airsoft customization?

Either of those barrels are fine, they just have different flight trajectory characteristics. The KM has a long range arc that is very consistent, whereas the Twist barrels have a laser straight trajectory and flies off in inconsistent directions once it passes its usable range. At higher powers, the fly away direction can even go upwards, but if you're using the barrel within its recommended power range (<1J), then you should be fine. It's actually pretty difficult to get a pistol to pass 1J without fairly heavy modifications anyways.

[Leang]

Originally Posted by Thenooblord

propane is cheap, and is always my first choice as propellant, and a TM MEU can handle it fine, and a TK twist barrel is never a bad choice ofr a pistol

Awesome! Thanks for the quick reply.

Originally Posted by ILLusion

HFC134a and R134a ARE the same thing. Lube is NOT the differentiation, unless it's specifically sold as an airsoft gas, and then it's just the same gas but with lube added. It is not defined as "HFC134a" or "R134a" in many cases of airsoft packaging.
134a in general is difficult to find in California's due to their "green" laws, and the fact that 134a is a hydrofluorocarbon (HFC) refrigerant that is harmful to the ozone (when released in mass quantities.) There are worse gasses for the environment.
It can still be found in California, but it is increasingly difficult to do so as more and more regulations are passed to control the sale and use.

Stick with propane. It's much cheaper, the performance benefits are much more worth it, and the MEU can handle it just fine. Except for an Airsoft Innovations propane adapter, you shouldn't need anything else to use propane on your Marui MEU.

Either of those barrels are fine, they just have different flight trajectory characteristics. The KM has a long range arc that is very consistent, whereas the Twist barrels have a laser straight trajectory and flies off in inconsistent directions once it passes its usable range. At higher powers, the fly away direction can even go upwards, but if you're using the barrel within its recommended power range (<1J), then you should be fine. It's actually pretty difficult to get a pistol to pass 1J without fairly heavy modifications anyways.

Sweet. That's exactly what I wanted to hear. My AI GunGas Kit is on its way now. For aesthetics, I'm trying to achieve something very similar to the photo you have in post 33. The slide will be stock black plastic, but I'd like the bushing and the barrels to be a matching silver or stainless steel. It looks like there are possibly 4 or 5 pieces I'll need to get. I colored them in blue here:



To be honest, the only parts I know the names for are the outer barrel and the inner TK Twist Barrel. ILLusion, can you list how much you charge for the required parts here (or in a pm if its against forum rules)? If the price is within my means, I'd be more than happy to just order all of it from you.

Now for a few more questions.

1. Without considering upgrading to a better frame, would upgrading any of the internals yield good results?

2. I've read that the weight is concentrated on the grip and magazine end. I'm hoping that the parts I'm obtaining for the silver tip will help even it out a little, but I'm not expecting it to make that much of a weight difference. Any tips to increase balance and pointability?

3. Would the MEU count as a 5.1?

4. How efficient are the stock internals in terms of efficient gas usage? Anything I should replace off the bat?

5. I'm a bit bummed that the Novak sites don't have the white dots to help aim. Anyone have thoughts on the Novak stock sites? This is ultimately a preference thing of course, but I'd still like to see how you guys personally feel about this.

This thread is by far the most informative resource I've found on the 1911/MEU. You guys are amazing!

[Slono]

Originally Posted by Leang

Awesome! Thanks for the quick reply.



Sweet. That's exactly what I wanted to hear. My AI GunGas Kit is on its way now. For aesthetics, I'm trying to achieve something very similar to the photo you have in post 33. The slide will be stock black plastic, but I'd like the bushing and the barrels to be a matching silver or stainless steel. It looks like there are possibly 4 or 5 pieces I'll need to get. I colored them in blue here:



To be honest, the only parts I know the names for are the outer barrel and the inner TK Twist Barrel. ILLusion, can you list how much you charge for the required parts here (or in a pm if its against forum rules)? If the price is within my means, I'd be more than happy to just order all of it from you.

Now for a few more questions.

1. Without considering upgrading to a better frame, would upgrading any of the internals yield good results?

2. I've read that the weight is concentrated on the grip and magazine end. I'm hoping that the parts I'm obtaining for the silver tip will help even it out a little, but I'm not expecting it to make that much of a weight difference. Any tips to increase balance and pointability?

3. Would the MEU count as a 5.1?

4. How efficient are the stock internals in terms of efficient gas usage? Anything I should replace off the bat?

5. I'm a bit bummed that the Novak sites don't have the white dots to help aim. Anyone have thoughts on the Novak stock sites? This is ultimately a preference thing of course, but I'd still like to see how you guys personally feel about this.

This thread is by far the most informative resource I've found on the 1911/MEU. You guys are amazing!

===========

Q1) Without considering upgrading to a better frame, would upgrading any of the internals yield good results?

A1) The frame actually does close to nothing for performance. Its what you put inside the gun that matters... just like a car. Leather seats and frosted windows won't give your car more horsepower. Having a stock frame with fully upgraded internals is absolutely fine and would still yield great results.

Q2) I've read that the weight is concentrated on the grip and magazine end. I'm hoping that the parts I'm obtaining for the silver tip will help even it out a little, but I'm not expecting it to make that much of a weight difference. Any tips to increase balance and pointability?

A2) If you think about how the weight of the gun is distributed in stock form, to counteract that weight, think about where you want more weight to be and upgrade all the parts in that area. In this case, you'll want to upgrade to at least a metal barrel, slide, and bushing set to give the tip of the barrel more weight. Steel parts give the most weight.

Q3) Would the MEU count as a 5.1?

A3) No. It counts as a 1911. 5.1 usually refers to a double stacker (hi-capa). Likewise, so does a 4.3. The MEU was derived from the 1911 single stacker.

Q4) How efficient are the stock internals in terms of efficient gas usage? Anything I should replace off the bat?

A4) In stock form, these guns already have great gas "mileage". The slide is light, so not a lot of gas is required to cycle it. Absolutely nothing is needed to be replaced right off the bat with Tokyo Marui 1911/hi-capa guns. That's the beauty of them.

Q5) I'm a bit bummed that the Novak sites don't have the white dots to help aim. Anyone have thoughts on the Novak stock sites? This is ultimately a preference thing of course, but I'd still like to see how you guys personally feel about this.

A5) Check THIS thread out. Long story short, glow in the dark or florescent adhesive dots are the best choice for these Novak sights. ILLusion sells them... I told him about them

-

Hope this helps.

[RacingManiac]

Only thing that is a "must" is the nozzle. Stock one will crack on propane. I'd recommand SD ones to replace it.