Contemplating 11.1v LIPO followed by motor upgrade.

EscapisT · December 31st, 2011, 01:03

As the title states. I'm afraid my ear's grown keen and my trigger response sounds a little sloppy.

Although silent and sound, my gears are slowing down my ROF... they're kingarms torque helical gears (100:300).

I bought them thinking torque gears are good for reducing stress on the motor... throw in an 11.1v and it should spin like a propeller through water right?
Does this seem like a viable upgrade scheme? I just want the snappy trigger response and I'll take whatever ROF increase comes with it..

I mean, you can't run a high speed motor, high speed ratio gears and a 330fps spring, all under an 11.1v can you? Won't one or the other give relatively quickly?

My specs:
VFC HK416 CQB
Madbull black python 6.01mm
KingArms Enhanced Hopup Unit w/ guarder clear bucking
Kingarms helical torque gears (100:300)
MODIFY high speed ultra piston w/ 7 metal teeth
BB spring guide and BB Aluminium cylinder head
sorbothane pad on cylinder head
Complete rewire in Modify Quantum Silver-Plated wire
Deans connectors duh!

MaciekA · December 31st, 2011, 01:53

A combination which has given me very snappy trigger response is a very high torque motor (eg: any ACM neo motor with a high number of winds like the JG Blue, or anything labelled "infinite torque up" with strong neodymium magnets) combined with high speed (15:1 or 13:1) gears. Your high torque motor will reach its maximum speed quicker than a high speed motor. If you do everything right, you can easily still achieve a nice high rps with this, even with a 7.4V LiPo, without crazy heat.

As you partially noted, you can reduce stress on the gears and motor by using a weaker spring, better shimming (and better contact between gears), better bushings, grease, etc, but also, you can use a more powerful motor with neodymium magnets (like the JG Blue).

One notable thing that's missing from your list if you intend to use a 11.1V LiPo is a MOSFET, which you will definitely need if you do not want your trigger contacts to go nuclear.

Personally, I don't think you absolutely need to go with an 11.1 until you've exhausted all your other options in terms of reducing friction and getting a more powerful/efficient motor. If an idiot like me can manage 20 - 25rps with reasonably strong springs on 7.4V batteries and good trigger response, anyone can

EscapisT · January 3rd, 2012, 01:53

Hm.

I already bought the torque up gears and installed them last summer. This sucks.

If I had high speed gears like 13:1 or 14:1 with a High torque motor I'd probably have great response from my 9.6v nunchuck.

Do you think someone would buy gears off the ASC classifieds? Or is there any way I could work around them?

This guy is running high torque gears with a high torque motor and his response sounds pleasing.
could it just be due to his large battery?
Airsoft - M4 trigger response. - YouTube

If I go for a torque motor now, will I really see an increase in response with the torque gears I have now? I'm pleased with my ROF as it is... I just don't like the spin-up time and sloppiness.

Styrak · January 3rd, 2012, 02:01

I'm wondering why you're using a torque motor with that low of an FPS setup, when you're wanting trigger reponse.

So you have a stock motor? Yeah just change the gears and you should be good, given you're running a low-ish spring and a lipo.

ThunderCactus · January 3rd, 2012, 02:25

Before even thinking about using LiPo batteries, install a MOSFET switch and use a 9.6v NiMH battery. A simple $30 MOSFET switch will noticeably increase your RoF, as well as significantly increase your trigger response. And although LiPo's are pretty safe (when handled properly), NiMH batteries are less expensive (since you probably already have an NiMH charger) and easier to maintain than LiPo.

LiPo makes your gun shoot faster, but there are certain safety requirements that NEED to be met, battery maintenance is more critical, and although the batteries themselves are very inexpensive, the upgrade to USE LiPo is around $150 (charger, wiring, MOSFET, battery, PCB, etc.)

Check out this thread for more info on LiPo
http://airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=99899

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December 31st, 2011, 01:03	#1
EscapisT Trader rating Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Montreal, QC	Contemplating 11.1v LIPO followed by motor upgrade. As the title states. I'm afraid my ear's grown keen and my trigger response sounds a little sloppy. Although silent and sound, my gears are slowing down my ROF... they're kingarms torque helical gears (100:300). I bought them thinking torque gears are good for reducing stress on the motor... throw in an 11.1v and it should spin like a propeller through water right? Does this seem like a viable upgrade scheme? I just want the snappy trigger response and I'll take whatever ROF increase comes with it.. I mean, you can't run a high speed motor, high speed ratio gears and a 330fps spring, all under an 11.1v can you? Won't one or the other give relatively quickly? My specs: VFC HK416 CQB Madbull black python 6.01mm KingArms Enhanced Hopup Unit w/ guarder clear bucking Kingarms helical torque gears (100:300) MODIFY high speed ultra piston w/ 7 metal teeth BB spring guide and BB Aluminium cylinder head sorbothane pad on cylinder head Complete rewire in Modify Quantum Silver-Plated wire Deans connectors duh! Last edited by EscapisT; December 31st, 2011 at 01:35..

December 31st, 2011, 01:53	#2
MaciekA Trader rating Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Portland, Oregon, USA	A combination which has given me very snappy trigger response is a very high torque motor (eg: any ACM neo motor with a high number of winds like the JG Blue, or anything labelled "infinite torque up" with strong neodymium magnets) combined with high speed (15:1 or 13:1) gears. Your high torque motor will reach its maximum speed quicker than a high speed motor. If you do everything right, you can easily still achieve a nice high rps with this, even with a 7.4V LiPo, without crazy heat. As you partially noted, you can reduce stress on the gears and motor by using a weaker spring, better shimming (and better contact between gears), better bushings, grease, etc, but also, you can use a more powerful motor with neodymium magnets (like the JG Blue). One notable thing that's missing from your list if you intend to use a 11.1V LiPo is a MOSFET, which you will definitely need if you do not want your trigger contacts to go nuclear. Personally, I don't think you absolutely need to go with an 11.1 until you've exhausted all your other options in terms of reducing friction and getting a more powerful/efficient motor. If an idiot like me can manage 20 - 25rps with reasonably strong springs on 7.4V batteries and good trigger response, anyone can __________________ "Mah check" Now you know

January 3rd, 2012, 01:53	#3
EscapisT Trader rating Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Montreal, QC	Hm. I already bought the torque up gears and installed them last summer. This sucks. If I had high speed gears like 13:1 or 14:1 with a High torque motor I'd probably have great response from my 9.6v nunchuck. Do you think someone would buy gears off the ASC classifieds? Or is there any way I could work around them? This guy is running high torque gears with a high torque motor and his response sounds pleasing. could it just be due to his large battery? Airsoft - M4 trigger response. - YouTube If I go for a torque motor now, will I really see an increase in response with the torque gears I have now? I'm pleased with my ROF as it is... I just don't like the spin-up time and sloppiness. Last edited by EscapisT; January 3rd, 2012 at 01:59..

January 3rd, 2012, 02:01	#4
Styrak Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Saskatoon, SK	I'm wondering why you're using a torque motor with that low of an FPS setup, when you're wanting trigger reponse. So you have a stock motor? Yeah just change the gears and you should be good, given you're running a low-ish spring and a lipo. __________________ Airsoft Sales and Repair/Upgrade Services

January 3rd, 2012, 02:25	#5
ThunderCactus Not Eye Safe, Pretty Boy Maximus on the field take his picture! Trader rating Join Date: Feb 2007	Before even thinking about using LiPo batteries, install a MOSFET switch and use a 9.6v NiMH battery. A simple $30 MOSFET switch will noticeably increase your RoF, as well as significantly increase your trigger response. And although LiPo's are pretty safe (when handled properly), NiMH batteries are less expensive (since you probably already have an NiMH charger) and easier to maintain than LiPo. LiPo makes your gun shoot faster, but there are certain safety requirements that NEED to be met, battery maintenance is more critical, and although the batteries themselves are very inexpensive, the upgrade to USE LiPo is around $150 (charger, wiring, MOSFET, battery, PCB, etc.) Check out this thread for more info on LiPo http://airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=99899

Contemplating 11.1v LIPO followed by motor upgrade.

Upgrades & Modifications